Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

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Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Dr. Courtney has been pestering me about a water tank http://c-sng-discussion-forum.41377.n7.nabble.com/Extra-74-76-East-td10630.html#a10648 that appears in photos now and again. I started this model sometime in the 90s based on drawings of the Idaho Springs water tank prepared by Harry Brunk. What caught my eye about that tank--being an Architect--was the cast iron columns that were part of the support structure. I had not seen these before, but I gather they were reasonably common on other tanks in the late 19th C.

So, I pressed on and made the barrel from Evergreen styrene. I searched for a while for suitable columns and never found any. Being an impatient fellow, I proceeded to make a base from square stock. I also constructed a conical roof with some (rather expensive) styrene shingles I found. I got it this far when I set it aside over ten years ago.

With the advent of 3d printing, the cast iron column is no longer an issue (these can be found on my Shapeways site, Poverty Flats Model Company). Now that Jim and Mike have alerted us to the fact that the Three Mile / Birdseye tank had cast iron columns and was the smaller size barrel as at Idaho Springs, I may change plans and add this to the Highline.

It took a while, but I located the 3d prints (I need to stop collecting parts for future projects!), and these are getting primed. My columns are a bit beefier than those at Birdseye. I will start to disassemble the tank and remove the roof. Looks like I need to reconstruct the gallows, too.

I have no idea why, but water tanks are the most sentimental railroad structures for me. Years ago my Dad built a model of a D&RGW tank from a Timberline kit. It is one of my favorite models.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Nabble doesn't seem to like the photo, so here it is again.

And a photo of the columns:

One reason I like them is that they have "entisas," curving sides that enhance the proportion of the column. This effect was used with mystical success at the Parthenon in Athens.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Progress disassembling the model.

It is always interesting to see how I built models after the fact.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
New beams.

Frost box and columns in place.

On to the roof tomorrow!
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Columns on, sub-roof on, first coat of paint. First locomotive.

Tom Klinger notes Three Mile was really for LMB crews to top off before heading up the hill. Seems really odd to have a tank here and then not have one at the top of Fremont (or Boreas) Pass. I mean, if you are going to stop to set the retainers and check the brakes, you may as well have the Fireman get wet.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Mike Trent
Administrator
LMB?
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Chris Walker
Keith, there probably wasn't a good source of water above French Gulch other than the crossing of the Arkansas at Wortmans below the pass.  The Kokomo tank was only 10 miles on from French G.  

Has anyone seen documentation as to the reach of the 3rd-rail past Leadville Mineral Belt Jct as to whether it extended to 3-Mile Tank?  I'm figuring it wasn't, that the crew just cut and ran there for water rather than taking the cut of cars.
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

ComoDepot
In reply to this post by Keith Hayes
Could you make one in 1 to 1 scale?
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
In reply to this post by Mike Trent
LMB = Leadville Mineral Belt. The 3rd rail stopped just past the D&RGW crossing if the photo in C&Sng is true.

Anyone got a good clear view of the gallows?
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile Water Tank

Chris Walker
Keith are you refering to this image?


Mac Poor photo.

this isn't LMB, it's the Chrysolite Branch(Ibex) of the D&RG to which the C&S 3-rail had been cut back to the time of Mac Poor's photo.  Poor lists a 530 car siding at mp149.96.  LMB was 3-railed.
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Jim Courtney
In reply to this post by Keith Hayes
The photo in C&SnG to which you refer is likely from after the abandonment of the LMB in 1938, the 3-rail track taken up to just north of the D&RG crossing of the C&S mainline, north of the wye in the roundhouse area.

As built in April, 1900, the entire LMB was a three rail system to serve the mines above Leadville. Thus 3-rail trackage had to have been built north, up the mainline, to just beyond LMB Junction which was just past MP 150.

In the early years of the first decade, the C&S owned a half interest in the Colorado Midland. Standard gauge cars for LMB spurs came and went via the Midland, narrow gauge lading went out to Denver by the C&S.

Motive power for the mixed gauge consists was always narrow gauge, often Rhode Islands, like C&S 60 and 62

Source, Mac Poor, page 298.


BTW, that's a fine water tank a-building.  If you locate it between Leadville and Climax, all the freights can make a water stop, both ways.
Jim Courtney
Poulsbo, WA
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Re: Three Mile Water Tank

Jim Courtney
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Chris Walker
Chris,

I pulled out my copy of the C&S Valuation Map of 1918 and studied it with a magnifying glass.

Though Poor may list a 500+ car siding at LMB Junction, the maps (several) don't show any siding in 1918, just the LMB branching off the mainline to the South.

There is a lot of detail on the maps (signs, box culverts, cribbing, overhead phone and power line crossings, etc), and there is a "Yard Limits" sign about a half mile upgrade from the LMB Junction. There is no "End of Third Rail" sign.  Perhaps, the Yard Limit was where the three rail ended. That would be quite a distance south of THREE MILE TANK.  Interestingly, one mile north and south of THREE MILE TANK were signs "One Mile to Water Tank".

I suspect that you are right, that the Leadville/LMB switcher would cut off the consist of cars for the LMB customers, and run light up to the water tank. I can't think why a train crew would haul a cut of cars for the LMB a couple of miles upgrade, just to take water.

Since this switching job involved a fair amount of trackage, do you think the switch job had an assigned caboose, or did everyone crowd onto the locomotive?.

Birds Eye Spur was, as you say, 2.7 miles upgrade from the water tank. The spur (in 1918) was north facing off the mainline after it made a 180 degree turn left, and crossed over Birds Eye Gulch on a high fill. There was a section house, coal house and privy, along with a "log skid" along the spur.  Keith, this might make for a nice little scene in the back, left corner of your layout space.

These two Otto Perry photos of Leadville bound C&S 74 are presumably just north and south of the horseshoe curve at Birds Eye Spur:

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/43102/rec/8



The switch stand for Birds Eye spur would have been behind Otto's right shoulder. The 180 degree curve on fill would have been behind him.


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p15330coll22/id/43136/rec/11



It certainly is a "birds eye" view of the Blue River valley below.  And might that be the Three Mile Tank, way off down grade, to the right of the locomotive?  Or is it just a tree.  Anyways, the steepness of the grade is impressive.
Jim Courtney
Poulsbo, WA
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Re: LMB junction.

Chris Walker
Part of this Map was included in the Map Pocket of Digerness' The Mineral Belt Vol-I

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p16079coll39/id/827/rv/singleitem/rec/37



Though Poor may list a 500+ car siding at LMB Junction, the maps (several) don't show any siding in 1918, just the LMB branching off the mainline to the South.


Jim.

Then I would have to conclude that the 530 car cap is the side track capacity of said LMB.

there is a "Yard Limits" sign about a half mile upgrade from the LMB Junction.

I always wondered  just how far out that YL sign was; it would stand to reason that the 3-rail would extend some distance to allow long cuts of mixed gauge cars to be propelled or pulled off the LMB.  

Since this switching job involved a fair amount of trackage, do you think the switch job had an assigned caboose, or did everyone crowd onto the locomotive?

Since it is in Yard limits, I'd question the need for said Caboose however Winter may dictate otherwise.

I would not be surprised if the various Switch jobs that went out on the LMB, had cars on both ends of the Loco to facilitate both facing and trailing Switches however since I can only figure the gradients must have been steep, maybe there weren't that many to be handled per inbound trip by one ng Loco.  There was a runaround track up at Graham Park.

A question to ask would be .... when was the C&S Roundhouse Tank removed and was it that removal that keep the LMB crews running to Three Mile?

I'll now return you the regular program.   Over to you Keith


UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
In reply to this post by Keith Hayes
Band connectors just in from Shapeways.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Jim Courtney
Cool . . . are these for sale in your Shapeways shop?
Jim Courtney
Poulsbo, WA
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Not yet, but give me a month and they will be available in 1:64 and 1:48. I checked them out tonight and the parts appear to be at the correct size for scale: They are incredibly fine. One can see under the bolt shaft that connects the two parts. I wonder when I get them painted if you will be able to see the nuts on the end of the rod?

Stay tuned.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

snapped_bolt
In reply to this post by Keith Hayes


    Hey!

     I have an assembled water tank...stalled at the point of "I need band connectors!" about 10 years ago. Keith, I need band connectors!!! Got any in On3?!?


    Seriously-

      Stan
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
This post was updated on .
Stan, I just posted the band connectors on my Shapeways shop in both 1:64 and 1:48. I hope it suits your needs.

Here is a clip of the model of that tiny part:


Since the parts turned out so nicely (though I don't think the rivets rendered for all the fuss), I may try to fabricate some other band and rod connector options in 1:64 and 1:48. But first I need to finish some Estabrook depot parts.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

snapped_bolt


   Hi Keith

    May your parts for Estabrook form rapidly.
    Any chance you are planning the double-bolt version? I need to do a Selkirk tank....


      Looking good.

       Later,

        Stan
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Re: Three Mile / Birdseye Water Tank

Keith Hayes
Today we had time to unpack the parts and put them in a brief alcohol bath to wash off the gunk. Here my guy is disassembling the spruce.

I followed with a dusting of camo primer.

Now you can start to see the detail. These are REALLY fragile parts. I am thinking the two bolt versions may need use brass rod for the bolts.

Now to study Birdseye so I can weathering for the barrel.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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