One For The Buffalo Hunters.

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One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Chris Walker

OK you will have to flop this one but a rare early DSP&P view, unpublished for sure, and clearly showing the original fabricated not cast Harp Switchstands then in use.

http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/4931/rv/singleitem/rec/274

UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Rick Steele
Nice find Chris. They are definitely not the cast stands. This just leads me to wonder if the cast stands were part of the UP takeover of the line and the standardization that the UP imposed on everything from Depots to Rolling stock.

I'm not saying that it was, but the UP used the same design of switch stand on their broad gauge lines.

You then have to wonder whether these were purchased from a manufacturer (Like the ubiquitous Star Switch stands are) or were cast in their own foundry in either Omaha or Armstrong.

It looks like the weak point of the fabricated stands is the attachment point of the curved portion to the legs. With regular use the rivets that hold these things together, in four places minimum, plus the pivot link to throw the rod, would work lose and these stands would lose their ability to hold things in line. If they were iron and not steel stands, the cold weather could really make things brittle.

Rick
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Derrell Poole
In reply to this post by Chris Walker
I read somewhere that there were as many as five spurs off this spur in that area south of town. The flat car with the wood cage on top of it is very interesting - but logical. A tribute to how versatile these cars were AND why the SP had so many of them.

Hmmmm.... no humans in the view. One might think it was Sunday Morning (no church in view so that could suggest the consequences of Saturday night) except that in this view the sun rises in the west.
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Derrell Poole
In reply to this post by Rick Steele
I believe I see three switch stands in this view. The stand for the passing siding seems different than the one for the spur. And the one barely discernible to the far "right" is too vague to tell.
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Robert McFarland
Compare this photo with Ted Kiersey's 00104.
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Chris Walker
In reply to this post by Derrell Poole
This view I think pre-dates the Passing track at Buffalo, I can only see a ragged edge to the hillside where the Passing track would be, that vertical protrusion looks to be below the the gradeline to be a Sw-St which normally sits above the Tie-edge line.

http://www.narrowgauge.org/images/tkcok/m00104.jpg 
from the  http://www.narrowgauge.org/ncmap/ted/final.html
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Derrell Poole
Hmmmmmm. Agreed this predates the first photo. BUT. Then is that smoke of a burned down building in the first photo?
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Bill Uffelman
In reply to this post by Chris Walker
Getting footing to throw that harp stand on a snow icy day would be a real treat!

Bill Uffelman 

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android


From:"Chris Walker [via C&Sn3 Discussion Forum]" <[hidden email]>
Date:Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 4:33 PM
Subject:Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

This view I think pre-dates the Passing track at Buffalo, I can only see a ragged edge to the hillside where the Passing track would be, that vertical protrusion looks to be below the the gradeline to be a Sw-St which normally sits above the Tie-edge line.

http://www.narrowgauge.org/images/tkcok/m00104.jpg 
from the  http://www.narrowgauge.org/ncmap/ted/final.html
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand



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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Chris Walker
In reply to this post by Derrell Poole
Yeah I looked at that , the roof line appears to be of a Log-Hut, more likely of the type I would associate with the Alaskan gold-rush of the low slanted roof and a front lip in lieu of a veranda, a very common style.  Could very well be a smoke-up or a smudge on the print/plate, your choice {:))

Note that the appearance of a second Sw-St off the Main past the Siding Switch, visible in both photographs and more so in the Keirsey one, to me, looks more like a fence post or sign post, maybe a Milepost?  What ever it was, isn't visible in the Jackson photo of the Passenger train crossing the Worktrain at that spot pg165 of the Min Belt 1.   There isn't a great distance between them to be any variation in shape although I did wonder at first if there was a second siding behind the first, not now after comparing the two pictures.
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Chris Walker
In reply to this post by Rick Steele
Rick,
I have for some time thought the same hence my input over on the NGDGF on this subject sometime last year, noted that this type of early Sw-St was also used on the Carson & Colorado right up to the abandonment of the Montgomery pass line, Dave Grandt subsequently posted views for me so one day I can fabricate one full-size.  
I can't say I've noted in the earlyday views of the Sth Park that these were used West of Kenosha or at a pinch, Jefferson being quickly replaced by the more familiar cast Harp that we know today.  As for the date the UP influence spread, and the introduction I have no idea.  Most certainly the surviving stands at Alpine Tunnel were cast lettered "UP".
 
Here's my post January 26, 2013  http://ngdiscussion.net/phorum/read.php?1,233512,234191#msg-234191
The photo of the Romley depot is on pg 82 of Mal Ferrells The South Park Line. Mal must have waved his magic wand over that image as the Harp clearly shows "18 UP RY 83" just like the Mac Poor photo at Alpine.  Mac Poor's pic in Mineral Belt V2 is of another "18 UP RY 83" stand minus lever and rods at the Eastern end of the passing track at Alpine. There is also a Dick Kindig photo taken June 1940 showing the "1883" harpstand in the same location, the track is still in place there at that time, another photo shows a standard C&S style rotary swstand at the western end of the passing track still in place. There are later 1950's photo's in Dow Helmer's Historic Alpine Tunnel showing the rails gone and roadbed bulldozed.

Looking back over other clear harp locations the UP1883 style is present at Pitkin, Atlantic, Rarus Warrior siding, Romley and Garos. The furtherest West the DSP&P harp that I can see clearly shown was at Como. The UP1883 harps have a "bowtie" pivot point for the Lever also the arch has raised "ears" for the locking staple. The DSP&PRR harp on the other hand has a flattop arch with notches for the locking staple and a horizontal channel type pivot point for the lever.
Interestingly there was a "18 UP RR 77" Harp at Idaho Springs shown on pg204 Mal's C&SNG book. Thankfully Richard B Jackson made a point of photographing the swstands close-up for us to see.
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Doug Heitkamp



Kindig 1941



Doug Heitkamp
Centennial, CO
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Keith Hayes
Why do you suppose the original target was modified to a double diamond? Who did the drawing? Doesn't look like Balsam Shops. Also it is neat that this switch stand can both accommodate binary and three-way switches.
Keith Hayes
Leadville in Sn3
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Doug Heitkamp
Keith,

I believe the drawing was done by Kindig. I don't know about the targets.

Doug
Doug Heitkamp
Centennial, CO
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Rick Steele
The only thing that I could cogitate on as far as the targets go would be that they would be much easier to tell apart from a distance, over the D&RG ones. In a crowded Railroad City tracks have no ownership plates. There are lots of instances of Maintenance People getting tracks confused. Although the target in Kindig's plan is not the double-diamond, a remaining Harp Switch Stand on display in Rawlins, Wyoming still has the double-diamond of the UP System.

Rick
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Jeff Ramsey
In reply to this post by Chris Walker
Anyone notice that DPL's negative is backwards. Place a mirror to the left and then it looks normal
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

John Schapekahm
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Robert McFarland
After looking at the flipped photo it sure looks like the area around where the 2 Mason Bogies met,the Kiersey photo of the switch stand,and the general area where the J.W.Green store is.Thanks!
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Re: One For The Buffalo Hunters.

Robert McFarland
It would appear that Buffalo was end of track when this photo was taken.
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Re: One For The Harp Hunters.

Chris Walker
In reply to this post by Keith Hayes
In this picture of Beaver Brook I noticed that the CC had at this location the same, what I always associated with the targets of the D&RG.


http://digital.denverlibrary.org/cdm/fullbrowser/collection/p15330coll22/id/23218/rv/singleitem/rec/34
UpSideDownC
in New Zealand
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Re: One More For The Buffalo Hunters.

Chris Walker
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